Archive: Air Rifle to Live rounds :))))))) - The Explosives and Weapons Forum

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Air Rifle to Live rounds :)))))))

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Author	Topic: Air Rifle to Live rounds :)))))))
Predator Frequent Poster	posted January 25, 2000 09:55 AM Hee hee done it again This time, I got bored with my relatively low power air rifle.. It's old specs were: .177 Spring and Piston setup barrel length: 19inches Speed: 800fps It was low powered, so the other day, I decided to convert it. It's now still .177, but utilises .177 live rounds, and not compressed air The propellent is cap powder, the casings... well... large rivets lol and the holes needed re-drilling, the front iron sight got ripped off, the rivets trimmed down and polished, the projectiles molded over a hot stove and some of the harder bullets, like the steel ones were shaped out of old bolts Details on this soon Just have to pop back to the hardware stores to see if they have any of the rivets in 4.5mm to save me a bit of polishing, as the ones I have here are 4.85 mm :/ I even fashioned these rounds to look like the old ones with the big "Skirt" on the end. The bullet itself isjust over a inch in length ( the rivet heads weren't any longer ) and the projectile makes up about 9mm of it, and boattailed. In the bullet, there will approximately be a cap powder column of 4.5mm diameter and approximately 1.5cm length. Before I test fire the rifle in it's new configuration, will it give much of a kick? Will there be enough powder to send the projectile at a healthier higher speed? If not, I can always completely rechamber the rifle to accept a bigger casing And for once, my rifle isn't being electronically fired, this one is impact, via a few extensive modifications to my air rifle By the way... anyone familiar with the law, could you answer what the penalties are for converting a air rifle to live rounds? I think they are pretty severe... but I have done this in such a way so that to convert back to the air rifle ( albight significantly weakened ) will still fire. so if the cops come around.. I'll just show them my "Air" rifle It's amazing what you can do with a drill, a few files, a clamp and a set of pliers
Ho ju Moderator	posted January 25, 2000 12:15 PM that is sweet man. assuming that you did it al right (it sounds like you did) and that nothing malfunctions the only...ONLY problem i can forsee is the small borsize can only be used a few times with a "live" bullet until it needs to be cleaned (or you will see a DAMN big drop ina ccurecy) i remember talking to a guy about a .177 cal commercial rifle (not airgun...live rounds) that was used for long range varmit shooting. it had the same problem that i forsee wih your gun. it could only be shot like 4-5 times before it had to be cleaned. ------------------ -Knowledge is power, power leads to corruption, corruption is a crime, crime doesn't pay. So if you know to much you will go broke!!!
Predator Frequent Poster	posted January 25, 2000 03:21 PM Then so be it I don't mind cleaning it once every so often if it fires live rounds, all the more fun Hmmmm..... as it turns out, the rivets only come in sizes of 3mm, 4mm and 4.8mm. no in betweens :/ The guns are only designed to pop those sizes, there isn't any inbetween! Damn. You see, to get the 4.8mm rivet casing to fit in the bore, I had to stick it in the drill, clamp a file to the table and polish away till the cows came home to get it to fit. I don't have a lathe :/ I wonder if the lab technicians would be a little suspicious if I bought in a packet of rivets for re-sizing on the lathe....... Either that, or I'll just re-chamber the bit at the back where the bullet goes in.. it'll be a easier job if I don't have to polish each and every rivet "casing" I use :/
Predator Frequent Poster	posted January 25, 2000 03:26 PM Shit just realised how hard the barrel liner steel is :/ This drill is having it's job cut out trying to get the new chambering done and it's only new too Noooo!!!!! MsPaint is dead! It won't work! It keeps giving me a "not enough memory to complete operation" message :/ How odd.... never gave me that before the other day... :/ I can't draw anymore! My poor schematics...
Dr-D Frequent Poster	posted January 25, 2000 06:29 PM LOL, MS Paint gave you an out of memory error?!! LOL, you must have like 0bytes of free RAM at the time. Now this might be the case if you had PhotoShop and were making a huge print resolution image with lots of layers and such. But MSPAINT?! bwhwaha. Your system must be about ready to crash. reboot and you should be fine. Unless the mspaint prog is corrupt.
VeHeMT Frequent Poster	posted January 25, 2000 09:25 PM Predator has a tendency to make HUGE pictures in MS paint. Just look at his chain gun plans and his rc tank plans. The pictures are HUGE. ------------------ VeHeMT's Armoury
HMTD Factory Frequent Poster	posted January 25, 2000 11:33 PM Predator. Use acid to wear out the rivet till they became 4.5, the result is evenly smooth, I used acid to resize/etch tubes, worked well. The world record of muzzle velocity in small arms was won by a certain .177 made by Remington, dunno what kind of circumstance the test was done under, but .177 are fast.
§ unregistered	posted January 26, 2000 01:16 AM the .17 rem is still the fastest commercial round, achieving over 4100fps with a 20gr bullet (Note - air slugs av. 7-9gr). shooting a goat with one - the bullet penetrated about 2" creating a 4" entry wound, very explosive.
Ho ju Moderator	posted January 26, 2000 02:14 AM i think the rounds are called hornet's. or at least one manufacturer makes the .177 hornet, i think remington...but i am not sure ------------------ -Knowledge is power, power leads to corruption, corruption is a crime, crime doesn't pay. So if you know to much you will go broke!!! http://members.xoom.com/Splynncryth
® unregistered	posted January 26, 2000 04:20 AM no, the .17 hornet never was a commercial round. the .17 remington (comparable to a .223 necked down to .177) is its actual name.
Predator Frequent Poster	posted January 26, 2000 05:19 AM Ahhh! Found what the problem was Usually, I draw my pictures at either 1024768, or 20481536 Somehow, mspaint decided to channge the "pixels" option to "inches", making it think that I wanted a picture the size of a football field! :/ It was probably looking for about 256Gb's of ram.. HMTD Facotry, could you give a little more details as to the process of using acid to resize the tubes please? Ta §: I'm using custom made bullets, not the standard shop bought air rifle pellets. These bullets are about twice as long, sometimes longer, and solid, not hollow.
VeHeMT Frequent Poster	posted January 26, 2000 06:44 PM Hes not talking about standard air rifle pellets either . Hes talking about standard commercial smokeless powder fired rounds. ------------------ VeHeMT's Armoury
HMTD Factory Frequent Poster	posted January 27, 2000 05:02 AM Predator. I use diluted HCL to simmer metal tubes, for just changing the inner diameter and leave the outside diameter unaffected, I paint(or other ways to protect it) the outside so the acid only touch the bore and etch it, I use a smaller basin so I can shake it, make the concentration more even time to time, check it often so it won't overwork the tube. Another way is to seal the tube in one end and pour acid into it, let it stand vertically for long time, then check it many times, this take longer cuz the acid have to be thin so the bubble don't gush out the tube , kinda like pouring coke, but this method gives finer result and is very even. When finished, wash the tube with water, and use some metal polish like Brasso to polish, then put on some oil cuz the metal surface is new and vulnerable. The ammo named "Hornet" is .22 Hornet, centerfire cartridge.
Predator Frequent Poster	posted January 27, 2000 05:29 AM Ah I c Thanks man Vehemt: I believe he was talking about standard air rifle slugs.. quote: (Note - air slugs av. 7-9gr). The slugs I use are approximately 4 times+ heavier than the normal shop bought .177 air rifle slug.
VeHeMT Frequent Poster	posted January 28, 2000 12:23 AM Im still thinking he meant live rounds. After all, Remington is large bullet making company.
§ unregistered	posted January 28, 2000 01:01 AM ok, i just used the air rifle slug weight as a comparison.. nothing more. the .17 rem is a commercial smokeless powder round. think that should clear it up.
HMTD Factory Frequent Poster	posted January 28, 2000 02:55 AM Kinda coincidence, Predator, I checked my toy gun barrel(metal, made with layered tubes), it's used to fire toy caps and it's just about 4.5 mm, so if you can get tube sizes smaller than that, cases can be made with tubes and glue, and it would fit perfect. Check out hobby stores for K&S products, they also sell aluminum rods of 4.5mm, guess you can cut them into bullets.
Predator Frequent Poster	posted January 28, 2000 04:44 AM Sweet But what about the skirts? They are vital to the operation :/
VeHeMT Frequent Poster	posted January 28, 2000 07:03 PM They sell steel and brass rods too, The yellow plastic individual caps are fun to shoot out of my 4.5mm air rifle. They explode upon impact of a hard surface. I shot one point blank(15cm) at a toilet paper roll and it made the cap explode. I cant help you with the skirt though, the barrels rifling should still provide for a good trajectory. ------------------ VeHeMT's Armoury
HMTD Factory Frequent Poster	posted January 28, 2000 08:50 PM What skirt? Steel rod? never seen any, do they sell steel tubes also?
Predator Frequent Poster	posted January 28, 2000 10:20 PM The "Lip" at the back of the bullet case to stop it falling down the barrel... :/ looks like this: -----¦ -----¦ the bits jutting out are the "lips" thats the main problem you see :/ It was solved with the rivets, but don't come on pipes unfortunately :/
VeHeMT Frequent Poster	posted January 28, 2000 10:28 PM Ahh, I thought by skirt you meant the skirt at the back of air rifle pellets. I've never seen any steel tubes, only brass and aluminum. I think you should be able to ask your hobby store to order some steel rod. I got a 60cm length of 4.5mm for a launch rod a long time ago. I'd probably make projectiles out of the brass rod since its much easier to machine. ------------------ VeHeMT's Armoury

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