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Author	Topic: Acetone Peroxide - h202 test
Feticidal Fantasy Frequent Poster	posted August 02, 1999 03:41 PM I did an experiment for acetone peroxide using two differetns kinds of hydrogen peroxide, the %3 kind sold in brown bottles at the drug store and cream peroxide hair blech. The 3%(which i used double) worked good with a nice yield. I lit it with a safety fuse and it was fucking amazing. The cream peroxide hair blech stuff, it never really formed any crystals, just this white foam stuff, and once i let the foam dry, i made it into AP putty, and it did not ignite or react to flame at all. it wouldnt even burn.. by the way, I made the trimer(HCl) version. The bottle of h202 cream said it was 'stablized' does that mean it cannot react becuase it is stable and thats why it didnt work?.. anyways, just letting you all known not to use cream peroxide, and that 3% antiseptic shit works great.
poison Frequent Poster	posted August 02, 1999 06:07 PM This dosn't have to do witht he h2o2 but i had a idea im not sure if it would work at all actually i doubt it but can you use nitric acid instead of sulferic or hydrochloric or can you use nitric and a nother acid to make it stronger? -pois
Saiyan Knight Frequent Poster	posted August 02, 1999 07:20 PM The cream peroxide contains many impurities. You should use the liquid hydrogen peroxide hair bleach. Also I wouldn't go around trying different acids to use as a catalyst in making acetone peroxide other than hydrochloric and sulfuric acids. You could get hurt.
ezekiel Frequent Poster	posted August 03, 1999 08:26 AM I use 9% bottled stuff from the chemist , works just fine. I was temted to try the cream once but I looked at the packet and it was filled up with loads of other crap. The best thing to do if you want loads of H2O2 is to just steal it all from the chemist (the one near me keeps it behind the counter , so I usually have to pay). As for using other acids , I think using nitric would not create the expected result , either it would nitrate the end product - destroying it or making a different chemical (possibly still an explosive) - or it might not even react with them - so not product at all. ------------------ __ ezekiel@cannabismail.com "Hitler bad , explosions good"
megalomania Administrator	posted August 03, 1999 05:34 PM Once again, the difference between the dimer and the trimer is NOT the acid but the temperature at which the reaction takes place. The warmer the reaction, the more likely you will form the less desireable dimer. The reaction can use any acid to complete the reaction, as it is acid "catlyized." No acid is more or less powerful as it does not actually get used. Of course unintended byproducts can and do occur. The difference in yield on the small scale synthesis is probably not observable. I don't even know where hydrochloric acid comes into play out there in all of those crap books because I have found the original research data (that's how I know so much ) and it used sulfuric acid. HCl may just be a bit weaker vs. sulfuric acid, enough that pure sulfuric may cause unwanted heating so it needs to be diluted wheras HCl is already diluted most of the time. Any of the se acids works the same... There must be another research article out there comparing different acids, hmm. ------------------ Visit Megalomania's Explosives and Stuff at http://surf.to/megalomania
poison Frequent Poster	posted August 03, 1999 11:12 PM I thought that the acid made the diffrence and i been thinking that to man.... -pois
Feticidal Fantasy Frequent Poster	posted August 04, 1999 03:43 PM I also thought the acid made the difference, I decided to use HCl because at the time I bought it, I had no source of sulferic acid. Since then I have found they sell 93% sulferic acid at my local hardware store as a drain cleaner, but it is very expenisve ($15 for 32 oz) and the HCl(32%) was very cheap, I got 2 gallons for $3.99. I dont know what the tempature was for my reaction, I just did it out in the open, mixed it up then stuck it in the fridge, the bottle got noticeably warm as i was stiring but not too hot. Im going to buy some sulferic acid, pour it into a different container, fill the orignal container up with water and return it to the store for a full refund. hehe. ------------------ Want to learn how to make homemade explosives, weapons, and poisons? Come to my website! http://www.seduced.to/fuckyourmother
Pyrotek unregistered	posted August 16, 1999 03:24 PM I need to know how much of each ingredient i should use to make acetone peroxide. I have 9% hydrogen peroxide, 30% HCL, and I used nail polish remover cuz it has acetone. How much of each chemical should i put into the reaction? I've made acetone peroxide before with 30% HCl, 30% hydrogen peroxide(which i got from a lab), and nail polish remover. It had great yield, but I ran out of the H2O2, and only have a small amount of the 30% HCL left. Any Suggestions???
Saiyan Knight Frequent Poster	posted August 17, 1999 07:32 AM When using 9% hydrogen peroxide,use 300mL hydrogen peroxide 200mL acetone and 70mL hydrochloric acid.
dlwdaw Frequent Poster	posted August 30, 1999 06:57 PM use real acetone, i'am sure it will yeald a much purer and more stable product,not to mention more AP, all you do is go to the hardware store and buy it in the paint thinner section(near the paint section). you can also buy muriatic acid(hydrochloric acid).you can buy MEK(methyl ethyl ketone) to make MEK peroxide, you can also buy, I dont know if these are useful but here they are denatured alcohol linseed oil laquer thinner I love looking in hardware stores, they are cool. they've got pipes(I would only use PVC to make a pipe bomb, I have never made one but i want to make a small one), solvents, acids,glue, tools, ------------------ >><>signature<><< this is the cops give me all your ...ahem.. books on making, ahem.. bombs. :-)
poison Frequent Poster	posted August 30, 1999 07:39 PM How sensative is MEK peroxide? More then acetone peroxide? How stable and what is the shelf life of it? -pois
poison Frequent Poster	posted August 30, 1999 07:40 PM Sorry for all the questions but one more how do you make MEK peroxide? -pois
dlwdaw Frequent Poster	posted October 15, 1999 09:27 PM sorry for bringing up an OLD thread but... poisen was asking about MEK peroxide. I think MEK and acetone are the same thing, and same procedure same amount everything. ------------------ -dlwdaw "... always look on the positive side of things, blow things up not down" -- Ragnar Benson
Ho ju Moderator	posted October 15, 1999 10:07 PM what proportions should you use to make acetone peroxide when you have 100% acentone 3% h202 and 20% hcl? ------------------ Knowledge is power, power leads to corruption, corruption is a crime, crime doesn't pay. So if you know to much you will go broke!!
nbk2000 Moderator	posted October 16, 1999 05:15 AM MEK and acetone are 2 different but related chemicals. If you look at the formulas you'll see. They're both ketones and can both form peroxides. And here's an idea to try out. Use citric acid instead of H2SO4 or HCL. It works in the HMTD process and that uses peroxide as well so it should work. Citric is non-fuming and not corrosive to the skin so no special precautions required in handling. And as for all the questions about how much of this and that to use at this concentration, what ever happened to the scientific method? Make a batch, see how much you get, then make another batch with more or less of 1 chemical and see how much you get. If you get more, keep going till you don't get more product by adding more of the 1 chemical. Repeat with the other chemicals.
Ho ju Moderator	posted October 16, 1999 10:08 PM you know nbk that is a good point. i (along with other people on this forum) have taken advantage of it in some repects. what ever happend to expiermentation? (sp?) isn't that the basis of chem anyway? ------------------ Knowledge is power, power leads to corruption, corruption is a crime, crime doesn't pay. So if you know to much you will go broke!!
Bob's RAC unregistered	posted October 17, 1999 02:14 AM Does anyone have the stoichiometry of the reaction? Also, does anyone know what the optimum temperature for the trimer reaction to take place at and approximately how long it should be held at this temperature (72 hrs.)? Also has anyone had any experience with the shelf life and stability of the trimer below 0C? Bob's Rent A Cow
Loopkin A New Voice	posted October 17, 1999 06:54 AM I think the reaction may be : 3(C3H6O) + 3(H2O2) => C9H18O6 + 3H2O (tricycloacetone peroxide) and 2(C3H6O) + 2(H2O2) => C6H12O4 + 2H2O (dicycloacetone peroxide) But i'm not sure of it.
Ho ju Moderator	posted October 17, 1999 04:18 PM what type of container should i use. i know hcl does a number on metal but when using 400ml of 3% h202 and 200ml of acetone. would 90ml of 20% hcl do anything to a metal can? ------------------ Knowledge is power, power leads to corruption, corruption is a crime, crime doesn't pay. So if you know to much you will go broke!!
VeHeMT Frequent Poster	posted October 17, 1999 04:30 PM Just use a jar.
Ho ju Moderator	posted October 17, 1999 11:04 PM does the jar have to be sealed/ can it be sealed? or should it be left open to the air? ------------------ Knowledge is power, power leads to corruption, corruption is a crime, crime doesn't pay. So if you know to much you will go broke!!
Ho ju Moderator	posted October 21, 1999 04:03 PM has anyone used muriatic acid to make AP? if so how good does it work. ------------------ Knowledge is power, power leads to corruption, corruption is a crime, crime doesn't pay. So if you know to much you will go broke!!
VeHeMT Frequent Poster	posted October 21, 1999 07:11 PM It works fine
Ho ju Moderator	posted October 22, 1999 03:37 PM ok cool. that is what i am going to use, cause that is all i can get int he way of acids. (unless i want to go through pyrotek and get screwed.) ------------------ Knowledge is power, power leads to corruption, corruption is a crime, crime doesn't pay. So if you know to much you will go broke!!
Laser unregistered	posted January 28, 2000 11:14 PM In my several experiencies with AP production, I�ve allways used 30% H2O2, 98% H2SO4, and pure acetone. The container is a 500 Ml graduated glass , but it might be a regular glass. The temperature is hard to keep below 5 D Celsius, so the adition of acid must be very slow, in order to let it cool everytime it starts to warm up. Normaly, I add acid until a great amount of AP is already formed. To do this, the mixture have to be vigorously stirred, or otherwise, the AP already precipitated, will stay on top of the mixture, and the acid drops will strongly react with it, producing alot of more extra heat. When it becames practically impossible to avoid this situation, I stop adding acid, and I put the mixture on the fridge. After an hour or two, the entire mixture becomes like a consistent white cake inside the glass. I take it out of the glass, wich some times becames somewhat dificult because as I said, the "withe cake" gets very consistent, meaning that the mixture is mostly formed by AP. The next step is one of the most important ones, concerning stability and safety of the product and is the washing of AP. AP reacts violently with Sulfuric acid ( H2SO4 ), but only when dryed. In aquous solution, the mixture it is�nt dangerous, but before it could be dryed, it must be washed from every traces of Sulfuric acid. To do this, I use a piece of cloth (an old T shirt for ex. ), put the AP on the center, and make the cloth forming a bag with a litle hole on the top. Then I put it under a water tap, and let it wash for 15 or so minutes. The water will came out taking all the acid, and leaving a very nice and pure AP, that is now ok to dry. Remember, this last step is from a very high importance, or it almost certainly detonate, while it starts to get dry in contact with the Sulfuric acid. At this moment, I have about 1 kg of AP, stored in an open container for almost 1 month, and I havent notisted and kind of deterioration of the product. The weight is still the same as when I dry it, so no significant evaporation has acour. I�ve been thinking in mixing it with melted wax, to form a solid explosive, that probably will get somewhat more stable. I would apretiate any coments about this ideia. Tha�s all for now, and by the way: This discussion forum is great.

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